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Chat with Positive Discipline Facilitator & Associate, Kelly
of Jane Nelsen's positive discipline techniques and books
( www.positivediscipline.com )
10/27/04

PG 2
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22:06:16 Webmama_Tina ok, do you still have time kelly?
22:06:20 WeeHands yeah Kelly!
22:06:34 PDMod_Kelly We must treat the cause, not just the symptoms.
22:06:35 Webmama_Tina i know we go for 2 hours sometimes...but don't think you like to stay up THAT late all the time....lol
22:06:38 keebler night :)
22:06:56 PDMod_Kelly Yes, I can go longer.  I would just like to get some hot tea.
22:07:00 Webmama_Tina nite keebler!
22:07:06 elsie is this chat every week?
22:07:08 PDMod_Kelly I can zip back and forth between the screen and the kitchen.
22:07:38 mommy2caeli is that part of the exercise program?
22:07:38 Webmama_Tina ok, so who else has a burning question for kelly?
22:07:42 willowsmom Ohhh I have a question that just came up. lol
22:07:45 Webmama_Tina lol  mommy2caeli
22:07:47 elsie i have one
22:07:54 PDMod_Kelly :)
22:07:56 Webmama_Tina ok willowsmom next and then elsie
22:07:59 momofgng thanks all of you...sara...i'll being running into you again...hopefully tomorrow if i can get some assistance from the hubby with the bedtime routine
22:08:25 Webmama_Tina yeah do come check it out momofgng! its an awesome chat!
22:08:26 WeeHands see you then - it's all about the bedtime routine isn't it :D
22:08:38 Webmama_Tina there's transcripts on the transcripts page from past chats
22:09:01 willowsmom How do I get Willow to listen to me. lol She's 15 months old..and I think it's a moot point right now..but when I'm asking her to stop doing something...she just keeps on doing it unless I physically remove her from the situation. I just redirect her..is
22:09:06 willowsmom that all I can do right now?
22:09:24 Webmama_Tina oh so young
22:09:24 PDMod_Kelly Yes, you need to physically remove her.
22:09:33 PDMod_Kelly Say it once, then act.
22:09:46 willowsmom k so I'm doing the right thing then. lol
22:09:57 PDMod_Kelly We have to use the tongue in our shoe instead of only the tongue in our mouths.
22:10:10 Webmama_Tina lol, that's a good one kelly!
22:10:11 willowsmom LOL :) That's great
22:10:13 mommytocali that was pretty much my question, lol  Only mine is 17 months
22:10:15 PDMod_Kelly Yes.  We need to show children that we will follow through with kind and firm actions.
22:10:17 Webmama_Tina did you make that up yourself? LOL
22:10:19 momofgng amen miss kelly
22:10:34 PDMod_Kelly No, I didn't make that up.
22:10:39 willowsmom Yay!! I'm glad I'm doing it right :) lol
22:10:47 PDMod_Kelly One of the other PD Associates told me.
22:10:50 Webmama_Tina yeah i really like how jane says more action, less TALK""
22:10:52 elsie and how about when they're older? can i just say it once, then act, with my 5 year old?
22:11:02 PDMod_Kelly Yes, this works for any age.
22:11:14 PDMod_Kelly Again, we have to teach them that we will follow through.
22:11:28 WeeHands good night everyone - great chat Kelly!
22:11:29 willowsmom Thanks Kelly
22:11:35 willowsmom night Weehands :)
22:11:36 Webmama_Tina the hard part is doing it kind and firm and not out of anger, huh?
22:11:37 willowsmom See ya tomorrow
22:11:38 mommytocali bye sara
22:11:41 elsie i had a big discussion w/ my son's teacher today about not stepping in like that
22:12:20 PDMod_Kelly Goodnight Wee hands
22:12:48 Webmama_Tina elsie not stepping in like what?
22:13:03 PDMod_Kelly Yes, we have to really make ourselves believe that misbehavior is part of being a kid, that's it's just a matter of fact thing.
22:13:20 momofgng good night sara
22:13:22 elsie well, i physically removed him from a situation where I'd asked him to stop doing something unsafe and he did not stop
22:13:24 Webmama_Tina that's so hard.....it seems to be human nature to take it personally
22:13:31 PDMod_Kelly We have to deal with misbehavior as we do changing diapers, getting kids dressed, etc.
22:13:39 elsie his teacher said that was not being respectful of him
22:13:43 Webmama_Tina oh gosh and his teacher said not to do that?
22:13:51 Webmama_Tina yikes! great teacher, argh
22:14:08 willowsmom ugh!!
22:14:13 elsie actually, i love the teacher, but she's just ultra-PD" ya knoW?"
22:14:16 PDMod_Kelly Do you feel good about how you handled it?
22:14:27 momofgng i'd be finding a new teacher i believe
22:14:45 Webmama_Tina yeah some people cross the line
22:14:50 elsie well, i feel good and bad
22:15:04 elsie i handled it just the way i would at home, so i'm being consistent
22:15:07 PDMod_Kelly There really are lots and lots of ways" that people think about Positive Discipline."
22:15:16 PDMod_Kelly Positive Discipline is NOT permissiveness.
22:15:26 elsie but i was not handling it the way its normally handled in the classroom
22:15:26 Webmama_Tina i had an old director, whom i love, but used to tell us teachers not to use shhhhhh...because it was the same as saying shutup...but i disagreed because i think it depends on the tone you use
22:15:42 PDMod_Kelly I mean if you feel like you were being as respectful as possible, then that's all you can do.
22:16:02 PDMod_Kelly I've carried a screaming and kicking child out of a store just like any other mom and that's all I could do at the moment.
22:16:20 elsie it's the fact that i had to pick him up and remove him that bothers me...i mean, i'm not gonna be able to do that forever!
22:16:37 PDMod_Kelly What is his age?
22:16:41 elsie 5 1/2
22:16:45 PDMod_Kelly If you mentioned that above, I'm sorry, I didn't get it.
22:17:04 PDMod_Kelly Yes, I had to remove my children physcially still at 5 sometimes.
22:17:12 PDMod_Kelly Not fun, but sometimes required.
22:17:21 PDMod_Kelly typo.
22:17:25 elsie ok. glad to hear
22:17:30 PDMod_Kelly Oh, well on the typo.
22:17:54 elsie he just gest totally distracted in groups, and its like he doesnt hear me talking to him
22:17:55 momofgng isn't that just a way of checking back in with home base" to make sure Mom is still tuned in?"
22:17:56 PDMod_Kelly And moms, don't think you have to handle everything perfectly.  Do the best you can.
22:18:07 PDMod_Kelly Some days are better than others.
22:18:11 Webmama_Tina hell ya
22:18:18 willowsmom ty Kelly :)
22:18:19 Webmama_Tina some days are worse, lol
22:18:32 elsie 5 is my limit on experience...i'm wingin it from here out!
22:18:37 elsie i may be here every week!
22:18:44 PDMod_Kelly I teach this one workshop called Why My Kids Don't Listen""
22:18:47 Webmama_Tina lol...actually the PD chat is only monthly
22:18:56 elsie ok, every monTH!  :)
22:18:57 Webmama_Tina heck i think i need this chat daily
22:19:00 Webmama_Tina :)
22:19:02 PDMod_Kelly I'll see how many of the reasons I can remember.
22:19:14 willowsmom No kidding. lol
22:19:23 Webmama_Tina elsie was your question answered?
22:19:28 elsie the sad thing is i teach pd workshops at work!
22:19:34 PDMod_Kelly 1.  Adults don't get the child's attention before communicating.  (They don't use touch, eye contact and stand on the child's level.)
22:19:41 elsie yes it was.  just looking for validation today
22:19:43 elsie thank you!
22:19:49 Webmama_Tina :)
22:20:02 PDMod_Kelly Elsie, I am not a pefect parent because I teach parenting classes.
22:20:02 momofgng we are always looking for validation!
22:20:09 PDMod_Kelly That didn't come out right.
22:20:12 PDMod_Kelly LOL!
22:20:16 willowsmom lol
22:20:18 Webmama_Tina we know what you meant kelly!
22:20:22 PDMod_Kelly I'm not a perfet parent at all, even though I teach parenting classes.
22:20:28 Webmama_Tina you're a perfect parent cuz you're kelly! LOL
22:20:31 Webmama_Tina just kidding
22:20:44 Webmama_Tina *laughter*
22:20:45 PDMod_Kelly Just ask my kids!
22:20:58 elsie lol..i know i could ask mine!
22:21:09 elsie he tells me he's gonna go live with nana
22:21:10 Webmama_Tina yeah i screw up daily
22:21:13 PDMod_Kelly 2.  Children don't have the same priorities as adults.
22:21:16 Webmama_Tina and i only have one!
22:21:26 Webmama_Tina oh ain't that the truth!
22:21:52 PDMod_Kelly 3.  The development of the child tells the child to explore and the parents wish the child wouldn't explore. The voice of the child's development is usually stronger than the voice of the adult.
22:22:07 Webmama_Tina that's a good way to put it
22:22:30 willowsmom My friend who spanks her kids is always asking me why her kids are doing certain things...ie running around the house screaming, whining or whatever...I always tell her that they're doing what they're supposed to do. They're KIDS not Miniature Adults.
22:22:39 willowsmom She really doesn't like it when I say it. lol
22:22:40 PDMod_Kelly The other reasons aren't jumping into my brain though if someone wants to know the others, I can look for my handout.
22:22:44 momofgng i'm so interested and tempted to stay with you...but I must go catch some z's
22:22:56 PDMod_Kelly G
22:22:59 PDMod_Kelly Oops!
22:23:02 willowsmom Night Mom :)  Take care...Hope the biting gets better.
22:23:03 PDMod_Kelly Good night.
22:23:04 momofgng the biter will be here before i know it...and i have to get my strategy in place before he arrives
22:23:19 Webmama_Tina yeah come back next month and let us know how it goes!
22:23:25 Webmama_Tina :)
22:23:28 momofgng will do...thanks again
22:23:28 elsie ive got to get to bed too...i wa ssupposed to go to bed early tonight!
22:23:33 Webmama_Tina ok who's next with a burning question?
22:23:49 Webmama_Tina those of us on the west coast are just starting our evening
22:23:52 willowsmom Have you found your child's off switch? lol
22:23:59 willowsmom I can't find Willow's.
22:24:01 Webmama_Tina you guys must be east coast, eh? :)
22:24:05 willowsmom Apparently she doesn't have one. lol
22:24:07 elsie yeah...PA
22:24:09 Webmama_Tina off switch, LOL
22:24:10 willowsmom Central Time Zone here
22:24:12 willowsmom lol Tina
22:24:16 mommytocali pa here too
22:24:18 willowsmom I was of course, joking. lol
22:24:21 elsie my son thankfully, has a great big off switch
22:24:25 Webmama_Tina too funny
22:24:35 willowsmom Yay!! lucky you Elsie. lol
22:24:41 Webmama_Tina well my dd's off switch used to be sticking a boob in her mouth, LOL
22:24:43 PDMod_Kelly Okay, I now have my hot tea!
22:24:49 Webmama_Tina yay kelly!
22:24:50 willowsmom yummm tea
22:24:50 elsie i know i'm lucky!
22:24:55 mommytocali what's the best way to handle mini tantrums in a 17 month old, ignore or talk her through it?
22:25:00 elsie the kid puts himself to bed before 8 sometimes
22:25:05 PDMod_Kelly That will get me through until midnight. :)
22:25:19 Webmama_Tina wowee, how'd you do that elsie? lol
22:25:33 PDMod_Kelly Well, what worked for me was something kind of in between.
22:25:49 elsie i didnt- he did it by himself, slept through the ngiht by 5 weeks old, w/ NO pushin from me
22:25:56 elsie the kid's amazing :)
22:26:01 PDMod_Kelly I ignored in the fact that I didn't give in and I also didn't react with anger, etc.
22:26:05 Webmama_Tina this is the whining hour....i've been listening to my dd whine and cry for one reason or another to my dh since we started this chat...yay
22:26:09 Webmama_Tina better him than me
22:26:19 PDMod_Kelly But I stayed close by.
22:26:30 Webmama_Tina is he your first else?
22:26:32 mommytocali she realy is a good girl, so there not too big, but if she really wants something and can't have it she will throw a fit, up till now I have just ignored the tantrum, and she quits in under a minute
22:26:33 Webmama_Tina elsie
22:26:36 elsie yeah, my only
22:26:43 willowsmom Willow's just in my lap playing with her clothes. and pushing my hands away from the keyboard..ok now she's screaming at me
22:26:47 willowsmom ugh
22:26:55 Webmama_Tina oh so your next will be the opposite, eh? LOL
22:26:57 PDMod_Kelly When I got the feeling that it might be over or when my child stopped to look over at me, I held out my arms to let them know they could get a hug and that it was okay" that they "lost it.""
22:27:02 elsie lol...dont say it!
22:27:17 Webmama_Tina lol willowsmom, been there, done that
22:27:21 willowsmom That's a great tip Kelly!!!
22:27:23 willowsmom lol Tina
22:27:30 elsie ok, i gotta sleep.  thanks mamas!
22:27:43 mommytocali when Cali does something wrong, and I tell her she is wrong, she always comes at me for a kiss and hug
22:27:44 PDMod_Kelly One thing that can sometimes help prevent tantrums is to use some active listening and validate their feelings.
22:27:44 willowsmom night Elsie!
22:27:46 Webmama_Tina nite elsie!
22:28:10 PDMod_Kelly Saying something like, You really wish you could play with that can opener, don't you?""
22:28:30 PDMod_Kelly or You're sad that we have to leave the park right now, aren't you?""
22:28:30 mommytocali okay
22:28:39 mommytocali i usually do things like that :)
22:28:39 willowsmom When Willow has a tantrum...which is rare...I usually sit down with her and hold her...I sit with her through it...letting her know that she's not alone...kwim?
22:28:41 Webmama_Tina yeah i tell maeven i know its really hard when you can't get what you want" and "its so disappointing, i know""
22:28:47 Webmama_Tina does that sound ok?
22:29:00 PDMod_Kelly It doesn't mean that you give in or change what you're doing, but it lets them know that you at least understand a bit of what they are feeling.
22:29:35 PDMod_Kelly Also you can offer a hug first too.  That always helps acknowledge their feelings without saying a word.
22:29:51 mommytocali hugs are my favorite!
22:29:53 Webmama_Tina yeah sometimes that just works right away, sometimes not
22:29:54 willowsmom :)
22:30:05 PDMod_Kelly Tonight my 8 yo. was whining about her homework.  She really did have more than usual.
22:30:26 PDMod_Kelly She escalated her whining and started hitting some balloons.
22:30:58 PDMod_Kelly She handled it okay and then walked back to the table to start back on her homework.  I said, Would you like a hug?""
22:31:21 PDMod_Kelly She said YES!" and I hugged her and I could feel the stress leaving her body.  She seemed fine after that."
22:31:41 Webmama_Tina oh that's awesome!
22:31:42 mommytocali thats so great, i hope I can be like that
22:31:48 Webmama_Tina i wish it worked that well on my dd
22:32:13 Webmama_Tina she usually doesn't want a hug if i offer...but sometimes if i just give her one, she melts into me
22:32:40 PDMod_Kelly Everything seems to work better when they are older and when you and they have practiced it 600 times before.
22:32:45 willowsmom I look forward to Willow getting older and interacting with me more....I want to be this type of mom...I didn't have this type of mom....
22:33:10 Webmama_Tina yeah mine wasn't so patient with me....and its hard for me to be patient with maeven
22:33:13 Webmama_Tina i'm not very good at it
22:33:14 PDMod_Kelly That's why I love PD.  I really feel like I can set limits and still have a trusting relationship.
22:33:30 Webmama_Tina ok does anyone else have a question?
22:33:40 PDMod_Kelly Oh, I was the most unnatural mom ever!
22:33:52 PDMod_Kelly I don't know what I would have done if I hadn't found PD.
22:33:52 mommytocali so is positive discipline a must read for a new mom looking into PD?
22:34:00 Webmama_Tina you didn't use PD from the gitgo kelly?
22:34:17 PDMod_Kelly Yes, the book really does cover all of the pieces to the PD puzzle.
22:34:24 Webmama_Tina oh i would say yes mommytocali...
22:34:32 mommytocali k, i'll have to check it out
22:34:34 mommytocali thanks ladies
22:34:35 Webmama_Tina although i haven't read the book yet, i've read parts and used parts
22:34:37 PDMod_Kelly When my son was 18 months is when my mother in law suggested Jane Nelsen's book.
22:34:44 mommytocali time for me to join my sleepy girl in bed :)
22:34:52 PDMod_Kelly I knew I didn't want to spank, but I didn't know what else to do besides time out.
22:35:03 Webmama_Tina i knew about pd from the beginning but using it on your own child vs as a preschool teacher is so totally different!
22:35:26 PDMod_Kelly Yes, I think things are so different with one's own child.
22:35:32 willowsmom Night MommytoCali
22:35:33 Webmama_Tina ok kelly, can you explain how jane recommends using time out? i haven't read that book
22:35:44 Webmama_Tina night mommytocali!
22:35:55 mommytocali night all
22:35:57 PDMod_Kelly Parents get hooked" into behaviors in an emotional way that doesn't seem to happen as often in a teacher/child relationship."
22:35:58 mommytocali thanks for your help
22:36:18 PDMod_Kelly In PD, time out is only used as a calming down time.
22:36:31 PDMod_Kelly It's more like a cool off""
22:36:38 willowsmom i wish my kitten would listen to me....lol does PD work on animals...Ugh! :) j/k
22:36:41 Webmama_Tina i see...can you give us an example?
22:36:49 PDMod_Kelly It has never worked with my cat!
22:36:52 willowsmom lol
22:37:01 Webmama_Tina LOL! yeah animals are harder
22:37:12 Webmama_Tina if i could use it on my cats for peeing on my laundry, i would!
22:37:16 PDMod_Kelly Time out/Cool off isn't recommended for children under the age of 3.
22:37:28 PDMod_Kelly Wait!  There's a great article about this.
22:37:39 willowsmom I read something about kids who don't share....about putting the toy or object that they're fighting over into Time Out.
22:37:48 Webmama_Tina 3 or 3 and a half? i thought i saw 3 and a half on jane's website
22:37:51 willowsmom so that no one can play with it...
22:37:58 PDMod_Kelly How do I get a link in here Tina?
22:38:10 Webmama_Tina just type it with www a the begining
22:38:13 Webmama_Tina or copy/paste it
22:38:20 Webmama_Tina it will show as a link
22:38:25 Webmama_Tina clickable
22:38:29 Webmama_Tina and will open in a new window
22:39:18 PDMod_Kelly www.positivediscipline.com/articles/Time_Out_for_Children.html
22:39:49 mommy2caeli night all.
22:39:55 PDMod_Kelly night
22:39:59 willowsmom night mommy2caeli!
22:40:06 Webmama_Tina ACK!
22:40:21 Webmama_Tina i was trying to click on that link and i realized i had turned the popup stopper back on
22:40:22 willowsmom and then there were 3
22:40:23 willowsmom lol
22:40:39 Webmama_Tina so it wouldn't work, so when i unblocked the page it kicked me out of the chat...wooops!
22:40:45 Webmama_Tina can you give the link again, i lost it
22:41:00 PDMod_Kelly One thing I did was put the toy on top of the fridge and say to my kids, Let me know when you've worked out a plan for who plays with the toy when.  Then I'll get the toy back down."  This put the responsibility back on the kids for negotiating a plan."
22:41:24 willowsmom Do you use timers?
22:41:31 Webmama_Tina do you think my nearly 4yr old would be capable of coming up with a plan...or is it too soon for that?
22:41:50 PDMod_Kelly www.positivediscipline.com/articles/Time_Out_for_Children.html
22:42:01 Webmama_Tina thanks!
22:42:09 PDMod_Kelly Timers for the toy in time out?
22:42:16 willowsmom no no
22:42:17 willowsmom lol
22:42:30 PDMod_Kelly Sorry.  :)
22:42:42 Webmama_Tina ok so say you have a child that is losing control and being just a maniac...something that happens almost nightly lately....just kicking and being nasty and obviously looking for attention...even kicking with a smile on her face....
22:42:48 Webmama_Tina how would a time off work for that?
22:42:52 Webmama_Tina time out, sorry?
22:42:59 willowsmom Timers for your kids...in doing various things...like...sharing or if they're slow getting ready or to play beat the clock if they don't want to go to bed....
22:43:06 PDMod_Kelly A nearly four year old can start to work on solutions.  You can give some ideas when situations arise.
22:43:12 Webmama_Tina ok
22:43:47 PDMod_Kelly Well, if the child has a smile on their face, I'm not sure that they are really out of control" of their emotions."
22:43:53 PDMod_Kelly Know what  I mean?
22:43:59 Webmama_Tina well true
22:44:12 Webmama_Tina but she will not stop
22:44:17 PDMod_Kelly But anyway, let's say that the child IS out of control of their emotions, a parent can ask, Would it help you to go to time out?""
22:44:17 Webmama_Tina she just gets crazy
22:44:37 PDMod_Kelly This won't work though if the words time out" have been used in the past to signify a puniative time out."
22:44:45 Webmama_Tina i just hate the term time out...
22:45:00 PDMod_Kelly You have to SHOW kids how to calm down so at first you need to go to time out WITH them.
22:45:01 willowsmom what about...taking a breather...or a break
22:45:11 willowsmom as opposed to using time out""
22:45:13 PDMod_Kelly One way I showed my son how to calm down was when he was about 5 years old.
22:45:13 Webmama_Tina yeah that would work willowsmom, lol
22:45:13 willowsmom the words
22:45:29 PDMod_Kelly We went to his room and I tossed pillows to him for him to throw.
22:45:46 Webmama_Tina i tried that the other day...remembered you telling us that....it was fun!
22:45:48 PDMod_Kelly Of course he threw them at me, but that was okay.  I told him it was okay to throw them and kept passing them back to him.
22:45:57 Webmama_Tina i just kept telling her to throw it at me
22:46:01 PDMod_Kelly He threw until he was calmed down and he ended up laughing.
22:46:03 Webmama_Tina turned into a fun game
22:46:07 willowsmom :)
22:46:08 PDMod_Kelly I did this with my daughter when she was about 5 also.
22:46:19 Webmama_Tina i have to try to remember that one
22:46:34 willowsmom me too...I have a few years before I can start doing that...
22:46:35 PDMod_Kelly Within 30 minutes, BOTH kids just came up to me and said, Mom, I love you.""
22:46:48 willowsmom awww
22:46:58 PDMod_Kelly It was a strong signal to me that they really appreciated that I stayed with them when they were angry and I didn't get mad myself.
22:47:09 PDMod_Kelly I accepted" their anger and helped them through it."
22:47:15 Webmama_Tina yeah i need to do that
22:47:25 Webmama_Tina so how does one use a time out positively?
22:47:29 Webmama_Tina what does that look like?
22:47:35 Webmama_Tina can you walk us through it?
22:47:43 Webmama_Tina what to do and what not to do?
22:48:06 Webmama_Tina (i really need that book)
22:48:12 PDMod_Kelly One way is to create an area in your home for time out OR create a box that helps with time out.  I'll explain.
22:48:22 Webmama_Tina ok
22:49:19 PDMod_Kelly If you created an area, you would put things in the area that would help a child calm down --things like stuffed animals, pillows, a CD headset with classical or soft music, a hammering toy, a tracking tube or other liquid motion toy, stress balls, etc.
22:49:37 PDMod_Kelly Of course you have to put items in that are age appropriate and safe for the appropriate age.
22:50:04 PDMod_Kelly If you were using a box, just put all of these items in a box that the child could take with them somewhere in the house.
22:50:08 Webmama_Tina wow, in direct contrast to what dr phil suggests, he says not to send them to disneyland (their rooms), its too fun there...they need a place devoid of stimulation....i really don't like that guy's parenting tips
22:50:14 willowsmom That's a great idea
22:50:24 willowsmom I don't either Tina
22:50:26 willowsmom lol
22:50:30 PDMod_Kelly Then you need to talk about the items and show how to use them and role play with children ages 4 and up.
22:50:33 willowsmom Can't really stand the man in fact. lol
22:50:40 willowsmom Hi Stacy! Wb
22:50:46 PDMod_Kelly Do all of this when everyone is in a good mood.  That's when the best learning can take place.
22:50:48 Webmama_Tina i like his relationship advice, but not his parenting advice
22:50:51 Stacy_G. thanks!
22:50:52 Webmama_Tina welcome back stacy!
22:50:59 PDMod_Kelly Next you need to use the time out area or box when YOU get angry.
22:51:06 Webmama_Tina ok, i'm seriously thinking of doing this soon...i like that kelly
22:51:07 PDMod_Kelly We need to be appropriate models for our kids.
22:51:12 Stacy_G. i'm  :nak:
22:51:17 willowsmom :)
22:51:26 Webmama_Tina oh gosh great idea kelly! I LIKE that!
22:51:36 PDMod_Kelly Yes, I disagree with Dr. Phil on this.  Children do better when they FEEL better, not when they feel worse.
22:51:45 Stacy_G. ITA kelly
22:52:00 Webmama_Tina i have been wanting to create a relaxing space in my home actually....i am really wanting a comfy colorful overstuffed chair for reading and relaxing...that sounds like a good spot for this
22:52:18 willowsmom Yeah it does!
22:52:28 Webmama_Tina ok, so what nexT KELLY?
22:52:41 PDMod_Kelly My kids started using time out as a positive cool off ONLY AFTER I modeled using it myself.
22:52:43 Webmama_Tina i'm taking mental notes....i think i actually need this space more than maeven!
22:53:26 PDMod_Kelly So after you've role played when they are calm and after you've modeled, then you can ask if they want to use the time out spot when they are frustrated.
22:53:36 Stacy_G. I'm in the process of redoing one of our rooms when my business is gone.  I'll make a nice cozy place for this.
22:53:54 Webmama_Tina yeah all homes need a cozy spot, don'tya THINK?
22:53:57 PDMod_Kelly Try to catch the frustration as soon as possible because if it gets to the too far gone" mode, they really can't even hear what you're saying, even if they want to."
22:54:10 Webmama_Tina what is whith my caps tonite? they're all twonky! lol
22:54:30 Stacy_G. For a very very brief time I used the time outs punitively.  I'm so ashamed.  Anyway...this was almost two years ago and my two year STILL says:  Send him to time out!
22:54:36 Webmama_Tina ok, that's a tough one...will take some practice]
22:54:48 PDMod_Kelly At first, they might resist using the time out spot and at first they might use it inappropriate to escalate the tantrum.
22:55:11 Stacy_G. We'll have to call it a squshy spot" or something.  :)"
22:55:20 willowsmom lol
22:55:21 Webmama_Tina good idea!
22:55:24 PDMod_Kelly Stacy, I used time out inappropriate for a long time even after reading the PD book!
22:55:25 Webmama_Tina the comfort zone
22:55:45 Webmama_Tina ok so what would be inappropriate?
22:55:57 Stacy_G. I was fed up with them physically hurting each other so I made them time out when they fought.  It didn't help in the long run.  It only solved the issue in the short term.
22:56:12 PDMod_Kelly Anyway, know that it won't happen overnight.  They won't suddenly be able to go to the calm down area and calm down quickly.
22:56:18 Stacy_G. lesson learned.
22:56:20 PDMod_Kelly It takes lots of training and time.
22:56:37 PDMod_Kelly Well, I tried to SEND my child to time out.
22:56:41 PDMod_Kelly That never worked.
22:56:46 Stacy_G. they've outgrown a lot of that.
22:56:58 Stacy_G. rofl!  i tried that too.
22:57:00 PDMod_Kelly It really only works well if it's the child's choice.
22:57:07 Stacy_G. my book said it would work.  LOL
22:57:19 PDMod_Kelly And that's difficult with young kids --toddlers, 2's and 3's especially.
22:57:30 PDMod_Kelly Which book?? :)
22:57:41 PDMod_Kelly Just curious.
22:57:44 Stacy_G. Setting limits with the strong willed child.
22:58:02 Stacy_G. The actual information was really helpful, but the time out stuff was silly.
22:58:06 PDMod_Kelly Who's the author?
22:58:20 Stacy_G. nuts...I can't remember.  It isn't dobson though.
22:58:36 Stacy_G. He talked about using clear language and I found that helpful.
22:58:46 PDMod_Kelly In my anger management class, I do a role play with the parents where I send them to time out, then we discuss what they were thinking, did it help, etc.?
22:58:57 Stacy_G. I often say to Airon:  Before you do anything else, do _____.
22:59:16 Stacy_G. He would get sidetracked.  I rarely find myself in a begging situation.
22:59:20 PDMod_Kelly Most all of the parents agree that they were thinking things like I'm bad" or "I'll get even later", etc."
22:59:23 Stacy_G. That was a big problem before.
22:59:39 Stacy_G. uggg.
22:59:55 PDMod_Kelly Even after they all agree that time out doesn't work like they want it to, they STILL want to send their kids to time out and for the kid to think about what they have done.""
23:00:05 Stacy_G. I am better able to distinguish true PPD books now.
23:00:33 willowsmom I have the book...Discipline without Shouting or Spanking...
23:00:35 PDMod_Kelly Well there are TONS of parenting books on the market now.
23:00:49 PDMod_Kelly and of course ALL of them say that they have the answers.
23:01:14 Stacy_G. I find it is a combination of everything.
23:01:16 PDMod_Kelly And I guess there does need to be a full range of parenting books because different parents have different priorities.
23:01:40 Webmama_Tina kelly was it you that said that you can't have control over what your kids think?
23:02:03 PDMod_Kelly I don't remember.  If I did say it, then I was repeating someone else.
23:02:19 Webmama_Tina yeah i think thats so silly to think that kids will think about what they DID""
23:02:19 PDMod_Kelly Dr. Becky Bailey's audio tapes are excellent and I think she mentions this on one of her tapes.
23:02:38 Stacy_G. That makes total sense.  ,
23:02:40 PDMod_Kelly When I'm still upset, I'm not willing to think about my mistakes.
23:03:16 Webmama_Tina but i had never thought about it that way...why do you think you can control what your children think?
23:03:21 PDMod_Kelly After kids are calm , THEN parents can give assuring hugs and can work on a solution WITH the child.
23:03:45 Webmama_Tina oh that makes me think of the kahlil gabran poem
23:04:04 PDMod_Kelly I'm not sure why we think that Tina.  Maybe because we wish that we really could control their thoughts?
23:04:09 Stacy_G. what other questions were there tonight?
23:04:30 PDMod_Kelly I think most are asleep in their beds now.:)
23:04:36 Webmama_Tina lol
23:04:48 PDMod_Kelly But there was a good turn out.
23:04:54 Webmama_Tina yeah so let me get this straight...positive time out is just a cooling off period, right?
23:04:56 Stacy_G. good.
23:05:02 Webmama_Tina yes it went really WELL!
23:05:05 PDMod_Kelly Yes, a cooling off period.
23:05:16 willowsmom :) I'm so glad I saw the post about this chat tonight. :)
23:05:22 Stacy_G. me too.
23:05:23 PDMod_Kelly To teach calming skills and to regain control.
23:05:31 Webmama_Tina ok, good to know
23:05:40 Webmama_Tina thanks a ton kelly! as always
23:05:48 willowsmom Thanks Kelly :)
23:05:55 Webmama_Tina its past midnite your time i know!
23:05:57 Stacy_G. thank you kelly.
23:05:57 PDMod_Kelly I'm glad you moms were here.  I know we only covered a few questions, but I have decided that it's more helpful to go into depth.
23:06:06 Webmama_Tina and my family is ready for me to start the bedtime routine
23:06:11 PDMod_Kelly Okay!
23:06:12 Stacy_G. i appreciate your response to mine.
23:06:13 Webmama_Tina definitely
23:06:14 PDMod_Kelly Good night all!
23:06:20 willowsmom Night Kelly :)
23:06:32 Webmama_Tina nite kelly! see you next month! or one of your associates
23:06:34 Webmama_Tina :)
23:06:36 Stacy_G. I got off the chat and wrote out a list for airon in the am.  Then he can be in control of how he gets ready.
23:06:42 Stacy_G. night!
23:06:44 PDMod_Kelly Okay Tina.  I sent out an e-mail and we'll see who responds.1
23:06:49 Webmama_Tina great!
23:06:57 Webmama_Tina see you guys next time!
23:07:01 Webmama_Tina night all!
23:07:05 Stacy_G. night.

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